Wednesday, June 03, 2009

The Double Edged Sword Of Intelligence And Meeting Women

Hey guys,

What's Crippilating?

I was thinking the other day about the relation between intelligence and success with women.

What I've noticed is that in general there is an opposite and inverse reaction between how intelligent you are and how well you do with women pre-seduction community. Not to say NO smart guys consistently get girls outside the SUISC, simply an observation.

I bring this up, because obviously all of you guys reading this are smart. Stupid people tend not to go looking for answers to their love lives on the internet.

Being smart is a good thing overall obviously, but there are some very common pitfalls the intelligent fall into when dating. I want to outline a few of them for you here, you may find you do one or more these things.

1. Making excuses. This is the biggest thing, the smarter the guy, the more likely he is to rationalize why he shouldn't approach a girl, escalate the conversation, get a phone number, etc... And guess what? A lot of your excuses are going to be correct. However at the end of the day, every time you make an excuse, you miss out on an opportunity.

2. Over-thinking things. Once upon a time I had a student ask me what word to playfully push the girl on when telling her we weren't going to get along. He asked if it were " We are NEVER (push) going to get along" or " We ARE(push) never going to get along". There were more variations but you get the gist :) Smart people overcomplicate things. Especially once they get a little bit of knowledge in their heads. Whereas before when you were talking to a woman and she said something, you had NO idea what it meant... Now you see tests, and DHVs, and body language OH MY!!!! And by the time you're done sorting through all that to actually respond with the perfect thing... The girl is bored and leaving. Remember the SOA slogan " Less Thinking, more making moves."

3. Wanting to understand everything before being able to practice. This is the curse of the " Prepared" guy. He wants to study all forms of pickup, learn every line, and know the evolutionary reasons behind said techniques. The truth of the matter is, in the beginning more knowledge actually hurts you. In 12 Months To Mastery we still have not presented the students with the full model. And several students are racking up 3-10 lays a month. Why? Because they don't know any better. They just try things, and see what happens. So they have learned for themselves how THEY typically will go from meeting a girl to getting her into bed. This also helps develop natural logisitics skills as I constantly harp on them to think for themselves. Instead of asking a question or looking for an answer, make a mistake and see what doesn't work first.

4. Believing You are Better Than You Are, Because You Understand Theory. This is a huge one. Intellectual understanding and actual real life profeciency are two VERY different things when it comes to picking up women. If you read a couple of books and study a few systems for picku up, you could become a master of the knowledge involved in as little as a month depending on reading speed. However it's still going to take you 1-3 years depending on your overall social skills, natural advantages, practice habits, goals etc to get really good at cold approaching. This is probably not the case in other highly intellectual fields like computer programming and engineering where if you understand all the theory and processes, you can do them at will. You always want to make sure that you're real life application skills are better than you're knowledge of social dynamics...

5. Being uncomfortable with touching and escalation. Savoy once pointed this out to me. It seems very consistently the guys on bootcamps who had problems touching girls were the ones with the loftiest degrees. It seems the higher the level of education the less comfortable with touching and escalation. I don't know if it comes from the culture of these institutions or the demands on time, etc... But the correalation is there. Again this probably traces back to overthinking things or trying to solve all the possibilities instead of manning up and not being afraud to get rejected.

Hope that helps ya,



  1. Excellent post Sinn, I still contend with some of these from time to time but knowing about them helps out. Thanks for all your help!



  2. I have read somewhere that there are 2 ways of solving a problem(handling a situation or whatever).The first one is by thinking(in your mind) and the second one is by taking actions.
    It's up to you fellows

  3. good stuff

    Ive found some ways to balance overthinking are

    - aggression / assertiveness (related to sex drive)
    - not caring about how you look to others or if things dont work out perfectly. IE willingness to fail infront of others
    - going back over experiences and analyzing them after theyve run their course, as opposed to before they have

  4. Great post, man! Like one of my older Natural Friends says, "A moron with confidence could be great at getting women."

    Come to think of it, we know a couple of not-so-bright guys who are pretty good.....

    Curtailing your thinking and just doing something without analyzing it, is one of the more difficult challenges.

    Sometimes, it's just easier to go the route of "5 Questions! It's sooooo eeeeeeasy."


  5. great post. reading books on pick-up then thinking you'll get laid every's like taking a bath then trying to swim in the ocean...and expecting they'll be the same.

  6. Anonymous3:59 PM

    Very true, and I say that as a "smart guy". I actually had ALL of those problems, I am not even over all of them yet

  7. Greg0074:39 PM

    Sinn, can you please address this good topic again (and in depth) on your overdue 13th audio podcast, as I have all these problems. And also do a video (as there isn't much around in instructional video demonstrating this) showing how to use kino in both day and night game interactions. Stuff like giving women high fives and taking a lady's hand and twirling her around that I've seen, comes across as too cheesy for me.

  8. dynamite again, Sinn.
    I can overthink things for sure.

  9. Anonymous9:02 PM


    Did I give you the idea to write this? For alot of it sounds like me....thanks


  10. Anonymous7:25 AM

    Hey sinn.

    Been doing your stack from the day game promotion book. A few times.

    Getting pretty consistent outcome.
    hb: 'I'm not special'.

    So, visually, what type of girls are capable and willing to try and answer it?

    Also what is your response to
    what's special about you?

  11. Jonsi8:35 AM

    Great post, and I'd love to see the "community" go into this more. Graduate students also have a higher prevalence of depression and anxiety, so their inner game issues might require a different focus. Much of pickup is the behavioral part of cognitive behavioral therapy, and inner game coaching would do well to incorporate the cognitive constructs.

    This is why I like your day game material. Intelligent women are only in the club one night a week. While there are transferable skills between the two settings, the attributes of intelligent men are more displayable in day game, and it's a better venue to meet that law student or medical intern. Touching is harder to teach, but for this demographic, I think most of the bootcamp programs are wrong the save daygame for an hour or two the last afternoon. This is why you rule, Sinn.

    And for those struggling with touch, see if your insurance covers massages, or find a massage college for cheap. Sure, it's nonsexual, and you aren't initiating it, but it does get you used to being touched too, which is a barrier that can be almost as strong as the discomfort in initiating touch.

  12. Anonymous11:26 AM

    This is a really great post.

    I find that most naturals either or sometimes not so bright. Or the ones who I know who are intellgient are more street/socially intellegient then book smarts. I wonder if it comes from feeling out your skill set when your younger and gravitating towards when your natural talenst lie.

  13. At one time i had no trouble pulling 7's, 8's & 9's from clubs for sex. i don't remember what i said or what i did, but it worked almost every night. Then i was away from active pick up for a long time. Now that i am back i have discovered the underground community and have begun breaking “pick-up” down into to its component parts … open, attraction, comfort, etc. For me, that is probably a bad idea. Suddenly i have all this anxiety. i finally figured out that it makes me expect it to be harder than it is ... if you say "interesting," i think VERY, VERY interesting. i apply that standard to the whole process, but in real life i find it isn't that hard. Perhaps that is the problem with highly intelligent people.

    An interesting story and how the community helped me understand it. One night in my previous life i was trying to pull the bride-to-be from her bachelorette party. I was telling her tomorrow she would be stuck sleeping with the same guy for the rest of her life. She wanted to come. I could see it in her eyes and hear it in her voice, but I could not pull it off. Suddenly she just turned off. It didn’t drive me nuts, but I never forgot it. After finding the community i finally realized she was saving face in front of all the women who meant the most to her in her life ... including her mother and future mother-in-law. It is funny now, but at the time i never gave ASD a moment's thought.

  14. Ahhhh...Hahahahahahahaha

    What is it with the Pick up community and its need to piss on intelligence! Did you all get pantsed in high school?

    "oooh smart guys are pussies. ooooh smart guys can't make a move. I know because I'm a smart guy, and I used to get no pussy"

    Alright snowflake, open up a dictionary and look up "intelligent". Now , look up "neurotic". Smart enough to figure it out? No? Grab the nearest virgin and ask him.

  15. Anonymous11:49 AM

    A good tip someone once told me after they realized I was analyzing every detail of how to approach women.

    He said picking up women is like playing checkers, not like playing chess, but you seem to be playing chess in this game, dumb it down and just play checkers. That perspective has helped me a lot.